Living in London has made me, in a “natural” way, come back to those three names: Shakespeare, Marx and Freud. The experience of advanced capitalism at its fiercest (represented by Oxford and Regent’s streets) made me go back to Marx and Engels (and also, as always, Walter Benjamin). I had avoided re-reading Freud for personal reasons (pshychoanalytic theory always depresses me, go figure), but one day Civilization and its Discontents found its way to my hands again. Recently, over a couple of pints, Andrea pointed out with acute clarity soemthing I had been thinking about London life: “uno se la pasa tan mal aquí que lo tiene que compensar con otras cosas”. By “otras cosas” she meant drinking, eating and shopping. What first surprises the first-time visitor in London is the amount of people drinking at almost all times (even if the early drinking licenses also surprise many an unsuspecting toursit). Indeed, in my humble foreigner’s opinion, two things are done in excess in this city: drinking and shopping. In a country like Mexico we have no idea whatsoever of what shopping means. Not even the wealthiest have the buying power of the average office worker here. “Seasons” really mean something and whole wardrobes are bought with every new climate change. There is rarely a shop without a queue: sometimes even before the shop opens to the public (the day that Kate Moss launched her collection for Top Shop, for instance, or the day that Nintendo offered their new console). One cannot but link these two excessive behaviours with the well-known repressive “English character”, its tendency towards personal privacy and individualism, the emphasis on social manners, the preoccupation with social class and the ever-conflictive relationship with the French. The weather imposes a great deal of pressure/repression on Londoners, it defines social relationships, fashion trends and consuming habits (this happens everywhere, but here there is a radical particularity about it: the Island is as moody as it’s multicultural character and as strict as the power of its currency). With Spring and inminent Summer people start smiling more, but in general there can be seen a great deal of misery in people’s faces. This is fought with alcoholic excitement and materialistic consolation. Oh Freud, indeed. If you think about it, there is not much to do besides drinking and shopping, (”and then dance/and drink/and screw/because there’s nothing else to do”, sang Jarvis) and even the highest cultural expressions are unavoidably surrounded by these (the museum’s shops, restaurants, cafés and bars). The repression imposed to make of this city a “civilized” one (if you don’t touch in your Oyster -transport- card, you can be fined A THOUSAND pounds; it will be impossible to smoke even outside buildings, there are more CCTV cameras in this city than taxis in Mexico City) is almost taken for granted by the average citizen, while any critique of it is perceived as either naïve or romantic (the stuff of sci-fi, comics and other Orwell descendants). Advanced capitalism, as exemplified by life in this city, seems to have guaranteed general unhappiness (disatisfaction) so the endless logic of desire is put in motion. Thus, the human being is doomed to a sense of perpetual unhappiness that is only aliviated through mindless consumerism and excessive alcohol (and drugs) intake. Such is life in these tropics.
It is impossible to overlook the extent to which civilization is built up on renunciation, how much it presupposes the non-satisfaction of powerful drives- by suppression, repression or some other means. Such “cultural frustration” dominates the large sphere of interpersonal relations; as we already know, it is the cause of the hostility that all civilizations have to contend with. [...] It is not easy to understand how it is possible to deprive a drive of satisfaction. It cannot be done without risk; if there is no economic compensation, one can expect serious disturbances.
-Herr Doktor S.F.
Freud frist published Civilization in 1930, and he would not arrive in London until 1938. One can only wonder how life in the capital made him rethink his ideas. The more I read this little book, the more I am convinced that what he was discribing was not only “civilization” or “culture” (as the term is translated into other languages, including Spanish), but capitalism itself. The equation of “civilization” and “culture” with capitalism is a problematic one in itself (probably not from a eurocentric position, though), but what is even more problematic for me is that it seems clear that his whole concept of “libidinal economy” (after Jung) was a capitalist notion. This is what explains all the Freud tee shirts and Zizek sold-out talks of the world: pyschoanalytic theory attempts a critique of everyday life without questioning its foundations (this was somehow discussed by Derrida in his book on the “States of Psychonalysis”, questioning if psychoanalytic theory could ever analyze itself).
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This post’s soundtrack:
June 17, 2007 at 3:31 pm
You should see how things look outside London – the misery on people’s faces as they wander through the shops is palpable…
June 17, 2007 at 4:05 pm
I am not going to claim for myself any expertise on Freud. I have really only started to read him seriously this last semester. But…I agree that a historical exploration of the foundations that shape humans (bodies and psyches) is very lacking in most psychanalytic theory. And that is often a critique leveled at Butler-her abstraction of bodies seems to lift them outside of historical forces (a fair critique to some extent). The problem, I think, lies in the fact that psychoanalyism is not interested in history. Freud was interested in mapping an inner life, and showing how social forces shaped that inner life. He was not after a commentary on those social forces. And I think with “Civilization and It’s Discontents” he took on the impossible project of mapping the psychic life of a civilizaton, something that cannot really be done without a through exploration of the social forces which shape people.
Shopping…it’s a big thing here as well. And I see your argument’s validity but I think that shopping has more than one theortical explanation. In Mexico, I also saw dispalys of shopping power. H’s parents dragged us to the malls a couple of times, and often treated us to brunch at Liverpool. While you are right that in England and the US, more people have at least min. buying power, wealthy Mexicans certainly buy like any good capitialist. I think it’s because shopping is more than just a way to deal with repression. Shopping is also a way to create desire and here’s where psychanlaysis via Lancan again comes into play. Buying things is a way to assert that you are “a have.” It also serves captialism by creating desire in the “have nots.” Umberto’s babysitter when he was two was an illegal immigrant from Mexico. Her parnter was a legal immigrant who told often of how he could never have the things in Mexico that he had here: a big truck, a huge t.v., and eventually he bought a house. But it was apparent from the way they accomulated things that the desire only grew and grew. It could never be feed. Shopping and being witness to shopping is a vicious cycle in captialism which feeds the system with desire. One thing that Deleuze hated about psychoanlyism was this notion of desire that he felt only supported captialism as opposed to critiquing it.
June 17, 2007 at 4:13 pm
Come to greater Los Angeles, Mazen, where you’ll have to factor in guns. Everyone – that’s only a slight exaggeration – is armed. We have a ridiculously high murder rate, something not seen in London. A coroner’s assistant told me that for every murder there are 1.5 suicides. This figure doesn’t include drug overdoses, and they are often ambiguous and hard to classify. So you’ll have to figure that in, too. Add in 10 million people with no viable mass transit who have developed an automobile fetish to compensate for having to spend 25% of their waking hours in their cars. London will begin to look like Paradise.
As for misery, without misery: no shopping. What is shopping but – however useless – the ONLY way to reduce anxiety (besides alcohol, crack, etc – which,it must be remembered, are also commodities. I believe induced anxiety is the motor of “our” stage of capitalism – whenever boredom isn’t. I think what you’re seeing is the return of the repressed by the oppressed.
You sound like Blake. “London”:
I wander through each chartered street,
Near where the chartered Thames does flow,
A mark in every face I meet,
Marks of weakness, marks of woe.
In every cry of every man,
In every infant’s cry of fear,
In every voice, in every ban,
The mind-forged manacles I hear:
etc.
Which brings us back to postmodernism = hopelessness, doesn’t it. But as Jon points out, who wants to admit hopelessness? That’s a sign of surrender. But (I’m speaking for myself now) from what other honest ground can one critique everyday life *besides* hopelessness? Have I surrendered? No. I do think the “proletariat” will win. But not til the entire earth has been globalized 100%. Only then will workers have leverage … but that’s another story … and a long way in the future …
June 17, 2007 at 4:23 pm
Let me just add one thing re: critiques of capitalism. Capitalism sells critiques of itself whenever they are made available and makes the exact same profit on them that it makes on everything else. Capitalism isn’t threatened by critiques. It is making money on this discussion. Every book by every name mentioned so far in this conversation is available via major publishers working through major commodity distribution networks in all good chain bookstores etc etc etc – even in malls. So I’d say to everyone: critique away. If you do a good job, there will be a film version coming to a theater near you. And you’ll be able to buy lots of stuff with what you’re paid.
June 17, 2007 at 4:42 pm
Thank you all for your comments. I have been thinking of “Capitalism and schizophrenia” as well. I haven’t read Deleuze in a while, but I realize that I keep coming back to notions he did work about. John’s spot on in his last comment. That’s what I dislike about someone like Zizek: he sits too comfortably within the system. His “critique” is the most accepted thing. Alan Moore, though successful, has had a bit of more decency regarding this (and what am I doing! comparing a mainstream comic book writer with a Philosopher!). But yes, V for Vendetta can be bought on DVD for a fiver. That’s why I’ve felt like a hopeless romantic over here, coming back, indeed, to William Blake, and Freud, and Marx. (Marx was a hopeless romantic as well, wasn’t he?).
June 17, 2007 at 4:54 pm
Ginger, regarding shopping in Mexico, especially Mexico City, you are right, of course that wealthy Mexicans can spend as much as everybody else. What is surprising, at least for me, is how in some socities it seems to be a much more generalized thing: it’s rare to see somone who hasn’t bought anything. In Mexico people do window-shop a lot, desire is “aspirational desire”, some sort of meta-desire, where lack of monetary resources increases the desirability of objects. The sense of material excess is incomparable in advanced economies. [In general; in comparison to "underdeveloped" countries] People can afford the things they desire; then those things are discarded and the shopping cycle continues. There is never satisfaction because things are not meant to last; they either stop functioning, they go bad, stop being fashionable or trendy, the weather changes so new clothes are needed or people just get bored with them. The shelf-life of products is much more limited here (you just have to read the “best before” labels). I read that Britain is the country that pollutes the most with textiles. Of course there is poverty over here and of course not everyone has the same buying power… it’s only a question of empyrical observation as a flanêur: look around and see how many people are buying stuff. You just don´t -can’t- see that in Mexico; perhaps only in certain places in certain times of the year, like Christmas… but not in any given day. A level of general dissatisfaction (”misery”) without the appropriate “economic compensation” (to quote Freud, even if he meant something else) would lead even more people to sucide. Or to a revolution. Eagleton said that American students didn’t put campus on fire anymore: no, now they kill each other, then shoot themselves. (That’s why it was so interesting ro read John’s comment about guns in the US). (On the alarming rate of suicides in the UK, see this). Curiously enough, unemployment is not a national concern: people are employed, but they are not happy. (Last month a City (London’s financial district) employee, male, single, in his twenties, jumped to his death from a fourth floor onto a double-decker; news like this are not uncommon). I wish I had more time to discuss this with all of you, dear, faithful readers!
June 17, 2007 at 5:32 pm
It’s a slow Sunday here in mid-Staffs…
A response to John B-R: my reading of *The Communist Manifesto* is exactly what you say here – the world will become completely capitalised before the proletariat revolt. I’m not sure if Marx and Engels thought on such a global level – their idea of capitalism is confined to countries, if I remember rightly.
The shopping and drinking combination, viewed on an English High Street, is very much a way of passing the weekend, and gendered: women go shopping while men drink and watch the football/motor racing/rugby/snooker on TV in the pub. It’s almost as if people are afraid of free time – what shall we do? – and need to anaethetise themselves while waiting for the working week to begin again. I don’t think most people view it like that, but it does seem to be what’s going on. Neither shopping nor drinking really cure anxiety, except in the moment of sale/consumption. I find that talking and doing things (walking, writing, reading, painting, etc) helps way more than shopping or drugs.
I remember, about 10 years ago, reading in punk fanzines, a very similar idea to what we’re discussing: that buying power is just an illusion of freedom. I know it comes from the Frankfurt school or somewhere (whose books, incidentally, are well hard to get hold of here). I’m not really sure what real freedom might be anymore… it does seem like we’re all endlessly complicit and implicated in this whole consumer culture. There’s a book by Vaneigem (who is published by small presses in English, but Gallimard in French, some of the time) called something like ‘Le fin de la societe marchande’ (it’s actually called ‘Pour l’abolition de la societe marchande pour une societe vivante’ [For the abolition of the consumer society for a living society]) which looks interesting, but the situationnist thing had been entirely co-opted by the establishment, mainly as the establishment now was teenage in the sixties, and felt that Vaneigem, Debord et al. were a real alternative. Zizek, on the other hand, is coming, in English at least, from a position well within the establishment, and fits with a lot of the stuff happening in academia. I don’t even think there’s a sense of revolt in Zizek – he works firmly within the tradition of the ruling class. Doesn’t everyone else feel uncomfortable with marxists who have highly paid university positions in blue chip universities?
June 17, 2007 at 5:44 pm
I love your insight, Jon. Thank you. It’s a slow Sunday here in WC1X as well. Even though books and records are also commodities (and isnt’ there something at work there when we see the masses in that video sing along to “Common People”? isn’t it postmodernism at its best?), but it is when I have time to read/think/write that I realize it is still somehow possible to avoid the dreary stupidity of every day life. Maybe the reason why I keep coming back here to this blog to write and establish this dialogue with you and all the known and unknown readers of it is because it’s about the only truly-free thing I do (even if the Internet is also co-opted and I’m doing this from a MacBook Pro and all that); the only activity where I feel almost completely free (that and physical excercise, walking, jogging, the gym, conversations with friends)… because it is profitless and purpose-less. It’s naive, I know, but at least it keeps me going.
June 17, 2007 at 5:45 pm
I’ve just realized how sad my last comment is.
June 17, 2007 at 6:56 pm
Ernesto, neither your “I keep coming back here to this blog to write and establish this dialogue with you and all the known and unknown readers of it is because it’s about the only truly-free thing” nor Jon’s “I find that talking and doing things (walking, writing, reading, painting, etc) helps way more than shopping or drugs” are sadder than the human universe, which has been a sad place for the last 10,000 years. I think of Bakhtin here: dialogism and answerability. Do they “solve/save” the human universe – and the planet? No, but that’s (sadly) beyond our power. Besides the world does not consciously at least want to be saved. What dialogism and answerability do accomplish is what Hans Richter was talking about when he described Dada thus: “We wanted to stay human.” Maybe that’s all we can do: stay human – for each other. And for those to come. I think a bit of Bakhtin’s personal history, when he lived, what he lived through, when his work was (finally) published. If he could carry on despite everything, so can we. Why not? It’s what we have to do.
June 17, 2007 at 7:08 pm
Man, what a great comment. Now I want a tee-shirt that says “WE WANTED TO STAY HUMAN”. ;)
June 17, 2007 at 7:21 pm
Check out http://www.ubu.com/film/richter.html
June 17, 2007 at 11:32 pm
Reading your post and quickly reading through the replies, I kept thinking that many of these observations convey a sense of nostalgia for a supposed better time, better sense of happiness, better lifestyle, better human-ness… and, lo and behold, the last word in these replies is “HUMAN”! Because my dissertation is centered on animals and what we do with animals in writing, I’ve been thinking and reading a lot about pets and how animals have become consumer goods. In New York, everyday I see more people walking with dogs, it seems as if there are more dogs than people or at least as if the number of dogs is equal to the number of humans living in this city. My first impulse is always to think that these dogs are filling in for something that is not there. How sad and lonely must people in this city be that they have to buy dogs and treat them as humans, see the dog hotels, dog spas, the hundreds of pet shops by the blocks, etc. Worst of all, you can’t help but wonder how much money these owners are spending on animals who would be happy to go fetch the ball and then eat, no need to get a manicure or dead sea mud massage. And then of course, I ask myself how many of these devoted dog owners treat human beings as well as they treat their dogs? The questions and problems are endless. But I really wonder if this idea that by shopping or drinking or by buying dogs we are enacting our misery, our loneliess and dissatisfaction, this idea that we lost something or are in search of something which is ultimately repressed inside us, is not just another fantasy, another thing to fill the void we sometimes feel with hope, the hope that there is a better way to live, and that specific activities will fill in that loneliness. What if this is what we get? What if unfulfilled desire is part of our genetic code?
June 18, 2007 at 4:17 am
I don’t think there ever was a time better than now, or worse than now, Adela. But it’s impossible – I should say I find it impossible – to ignoe the “fact” that we have created a human universe in which we are all miserable.
2 thoughts:
First, unfulfilled desire is, as I understand Freud and Lacan (which may not be all that well), the only kind of desire there is. Living with that is what it means to be human. I don’t think there’s anything nostalgic that. Of course it is possible to de-historicize what it means to be human, and imagine a timeless essence, and that would be nostalgic. I’m thinking, rather, about working on being dialogic and answerable. That’s all (all??) I mean by being human.
Second: what do you think of Donna Haraway’s move from the cyborg manifesto to the companion species manifesto, in terms of your own research?
June 18, 2007 at 5:11 am
“If we can prevent something bad without sacrificing anything of comparable significance, we ought to do it; absolute poverty is bad; there is some poverty we can prevent without sacrificing anything of comparable moral significance; therefore we ought to prevent some absolute poverty.”
Peter Singer
June 18, 2007 at 10:34 am
I guess that if there is some nostalgia from my part is a nostalgia not for a better past life, but for a better future possible life. For me, the answer “human” does not exclude “animal”. Because “human” would also be “humane”, meaning, above all, “ethical”. And with that I’m right there with John. (Bakhtin also wrote a book on ethics, The Philosophy of the Ethical Act”., so his literary theory was always grounded on a larger picture). So my “nostalgia” is for a way of living that would not be defined by fierce consumerism. What saddens me of dog spas is not necessarily the supposed “void” in the owner’s life, but the fact that there are people -and animals- in the world that starve and then there’s this people buying designer’s clothes for their pets. Newspapers here stop random people in the high street and ask them what they are wearing, where they bought it and how much they paid for it (so others can “get the look”). And you find out of students and hairdressers carrying 900 pounds handbags. Why would anyone need a 900-pound handbag, when there’s people who can’t have a loaf of bread (or much-needed medicines). So it is the excess what saddens me; the sense of radical disparity….
So yes, I am nostalgic for a different way of living that I believe is possible. Nostalgic for a critical thought still to come, where capitalism and injustice are not taken for granted. What depresses me from psychoanalytic theory is its premise that the logic of desire is an economic one and thus implies an essential unfairness between subjects and between subjects and things (not to say “objects”). It’s this Hegelian dialectic what grounds most social relationships. That’s why I look up to people as different as Bakhtin, Levinás or Riceour, because they advocate for ethics as “first philosophy”, instead of ontology (or phenomenology, in the Hegelian case).
June 18, 2007 at 3:09 pm
Ernesto, to be nostalgic for something we can only imagine – well, I AM *that* kind of nostalgic. Just not for any particular actual past. Ginger: YES YES YES. But *how?*
June 18, 2007 at 3:46 pm
He aquí un caso de la vida real.
June 18, 2007 at 6:06 pm
Everyday when I walk to school or I walk the streets of NYC (and of course, when I’m visiting Mexico) I see people who are miserable. They are alone, starving, half-demented, wandering the streets with one shoe while their bruised bare foot follows along or in the subways, tryint to steal a bench and turn it into a bed for at least a few hours. That is misery. I know there are manifold forms of misery, but I guess that the reaction driving my comments (and thanks for the thoughts and clarifications) is that I wonder what you, what we are miserable about. Lately, I’ve been feeling very un-miserable. This does not mean that I do not feel misery when I see it, or that a day goes by without feeling like I should do something about this misery, but I do not feel like I have misery or am miserable. So, my question is, what is this “misery” we are talking about here. I think it’s important to spell it out in order to do something about it or work with it.
Ah, Haraway… I’ve only read some of her stuff. I working with Vicki Hearne at the moment but Haraway is waiting for me at the end of the summer. So, more on that to come.
June 18, 2007 at 6:45 pm
Yes Adela, that is misery as well. I never said I was feeling “miserable” or that I was in misery myself. One does not have to be/feel miserable (in both senses of the word) in order to experience it/see it/share it/observe it/ talk about it. Just because we are lucky enough to have been born in a privileged context (and even though our individual contexts are also different) that at least gave us the necessary backdrop/foundation in order to do something with our lives that does not mean that we will then avoid talking about this “misery”, which in this context, what I mean by it, is the whole implications/consequences of life in the XXI century. I am talking about the capitalist system as experienced in the capital cities of the Western world, about war, genocides, global warming, ecocide, exploitation, inequality in all its forms.
Again, a dialogue from V for Vendetta (the graphic novel) comes to mind. Evey tells Gordon: “We shouldn’t have to live like this, should we?” Gordon replies, “What are you going to do about it?”. That’s what concerns me here. What are we, we few, we happy few, that can luckily call ourselves very “un-miserable”, going to do with this world we were born in? Will we only close our eyes to what’s around us only because we ourselves do not share the fate of many? Will we keep tricking ourselves into thinking that capitalism is the closest form to a perfect system, when it only takes a click to find out a bit more? More than one billion people still subsist on less than $1 a day, with many regions of the world still falling short of achieving the target. some 840 million people still suffer from undernourishment.. And still, I see here, everyday, in my daily life, how food is thrown away in enormous amounts. Just thrown away. My flatmates leave the the water tap at the kitchen sink running, just like that, at least twice a week: they let their food rot in the fridge, et cetera. I find that offensive. I find the so-called “civilized” world’s disrespect for the rest of the world’s condition absolutely offensive.
June 18, 2007 at 6:47 pm
Adela, very important question: what is the misery. Insterestingly (to me at least) I’m having a parallel discussion with another friend about Camus, in which my friend Alan quotes Camus as saying something like we have to imagine Sisyphus happy. So – there’s the existential problem. It’s tough to be an animal that knows it’s fated to die and to have lived and suffered and joyed for what may be no reason at all. There’s the Buddha’s interpretation of our situation as exemplified in the 4 noble truths, the first of which is all life is suffering (which I think parses to mean something like a life trapped in language and its delusions is suffering). But I don’t think the people you see in NYC or Ernesto sees in London or we all see everywhere every day are suffering existential crises, tho they may be suffering those, too. I think they are suffering from the inequities in the distribution of power and wealth. Otherwise they wouldn’t be “alone, starving, half-demented, wandering the streets with one shoe while their bruised bare foot follows along or in the subways, trying to steal a bench and turn it into a bed for at least a few hours” Or, if they are a little more affluent, they wouldn’t be shopping etc. In the case of the affluent, I think we can still use the Marxist term alienation, which is no longer just Marxist (mental doctors were once called alienists, right?). I’m personally pretty affluent, have a job, healthcare, a pension, etc can afford to buy luxury goods like books, etc, so I don’t experience what the folks you describe are experiencing. But I am on antidepressants and anti-anxiety meds. Why? In part because of a genetic predisposition, in part because of our existential situation and in part because of alienation. That’s why I meditate. That’s why I consider the dialogical and answerability so important. And I sure hope Ginger comes back with an answer to my how? Does this answer your question any?
June 18, 2007 at 7:00 pm
Ernesto, you write “Again, a dialogue from V for Vendetta (the graphic novel) comes to mind. Evey tells Gordon: “We shouldn’t have to live like this, should we?” Gordon replies, “What are you going to do about it?”. That’s what concerns me here. What are we, we few, we happy few, that can luckily call ourselves very “un-miserable”, going to do with this world we were born in? Will we only close our eyes to what’s around us only because we ourselves do not share the fate of many? Will we keep tricking ourselves into thinking that capitalism is the closest form to a perfect system, when it only takes a click to find out a bit more?”. I think a way to define the misery of the intelligentsia (in which i include all of us taking part in this conversation) is simple. There’s nothing we can do about it. We can do all we can, every way we can, but we don’t really believe it will make any difference. The word despair comes to mind here.
A question about V for Vendetta. I quote from a website:
As Alan Moore wrote in his behind-the-scenes article “Behind the Painted Smile”:
The big breakthrough [regarding what the character of V should look and act like] was all Dave’s, much as it sickens me to admit it. More remarkable still, it was all contained in one single letter that he’d dashed off the top of his head . . . I transcribe the relevant portions beneath:
“Re. The script: While I was writing this, I had this idea about the hero, which is a bit redundant now we’ve got (can’t read this next bit) but nonetheless . . . I was thinking, why don’t we portray him as a resurrected Guy Fawkes, complete with one of those papier mache masks, in a cape and conical hat? He’d look really bizarre and it would give Guy Fawkes the image he’s deserved all these years. We shouldn’t burn the chap every Nov. 5th but celebrate his attempt to blow up Parliament!”
The moment I read these words, two things occurred to me. Firstly, Dave was obviously a lot less sane than I hitherto believed him to be, and secondly, this was the best idea I’d ever heard in my entire life. All of the various fragments in my head suddenly fell into place, united behind the single image of a Guy Fawkes mask. ”
My question: since the plotters were definitely NOT blowing up Parliament for ANY reason which could be described as anarchist or libertarian or even liberal or anything like that, well, it isn’t really a question, but I don’t get it.
June 18, 2007 at 7:22 pm
The problem is that no one seems to think it’s relevant to ask that famous question again: ¿para qué poetas en tiempos de penuria? If we can’t agree these are times of “despair”, then the question remains impossible.
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John, I believe there is stuff we can do. Like talking about it. Like trying to live ethically, whatever that means, but at least living with an awareness that not everyone is as privileged and that there are things that are definitely wrong in this world.
Re: V, we have to remember that it was conceptualised-written-drawn int he mid eighties. Since the late sixties and the “great rock and roll siwindle” of punk there wasn’t much of a resistance to totalitarianism in popular culture in England (the Irish question would have to be addressed here though, but that’s why I say “England” here). Guy Fawkes was, perhaps, the closest to a British Che Guevara, as I see it. It was not the cause, but the fact that that the plotters dared to do something that back then in the eighties was unthinkable to resurrect…
June 18, 2007 at 7:37 pm
Ernesto, re: V, if Fawkes was the only choice for Che, what had happened to Winstanley, or Lilburne, or Walwyn, to name only 3? What you say means that folks had ellipsed out of their memory the entire 1640s-1650s, which was a truly revolutionary era – cf. the Levellers, Diggers, etc. But I know that that era was the great object of immense historical activity during the 80s – it was my job at the time to know all about it. Did that not filter down to “the masses”? Or were they truly radical, while Fawkes was faux-radical, and all people could really handle during Reagan/Thatcher was another great swindle, a bit of useless theatre? Which brings me to your “stuff we can do. Like talking about it. Like trying to live ethically, whatever that means, but at least living with an awareness that not everyone is as privileged and that there are things that are definitely wrong in this world.” If knowing all that and not being able to alter things in any significant way isn’t a recipe for MY despair at least, I don’t know what is. Do you know – of course you do – Debord? Is he the real theorist of the now?
June 18, 2007 at 7:39 pm
In “were they truly radical” in the above “they” means the Levellers, Diggers, etc not “the masses.” Sorry for the sloppy writing.
June 18, 2007 at 7:49 pm
RE: V, I didn’t want to say Fawkes was the only choice for Che… maybe the analogy is a bad one. I’m thinking in terms of iconic power here. V was thought of as a comic book to be published by a mainstream publication in a market flooded by superheroes. The mask concept worked well in the context of the masked vigilante figure as established by superhero comics, and the figure was anachronistic enough to provoke a bit of historical thinking in a traditionally de-historicized age. Alan Moore has constantly used historical figures/contexts for his comics. Turning Fawkes into a rebel vigilante was a “smashing” idea, I think. At the time the concept of the pastiche and the carnival (damn, Bakhtin again, but also David Bowie, and Lou Reed) is having it’s hey-day (it’s the mid-eighties, High Postmodernism if you ask me) and Britain is coming out of all the glam craze as defined by the theatrics of David Bowie’s stage personas. To the depoliticized figure of Ziggy Stardust, trapped in his self-reflexive, miserabilist space capsule, seeing the blueness of Planet Earth from above, Alan Moore and David Lloyd establish this figure of a masked subversive anti-hero, who makes of his “misery” the driving force for his political -libertarian- activism against a totalitarian state.
June 18, 2007 at 8:02 pm
I’ll read these replies tonight… I must away, but I just had a long conversation with Ch about “misery” because i knew I was evidently missing somethings… And I totally understand what you mean, E, by misery… I’ll read replies then answer. Can’t think when I’m in a rush. Thanks for getting such a great conversation going E and J.
June 18, 2007 at 11:49 pm
Thank you both so much for clarifying all this. I definitely was reading you from another point of view or, rather, coming from another frame of mind. I cannot but agree with you all about this state of misery. My terms were not in line with the discussion at first partly because I have been trying to escape other forms of misery, the kind that you describe, John. I just finished 2/1/2 years of psychoanalytic psychodynamic therapy and I’m waiting to hear from a psychoanalytic center I’ve applied to. So, the search for some kind of non-inner misery continues. But the misery of consumer society is, as we all agree, here to stay. Yet, I agree with and think like Ernesto… even talking about this and trying to imagine ways to help or change these inequalities is helpful. The one thing we *must* as critics search for is for a way of thinking about a kind of solidarity that will not end up as yet another market product. As Chris pointed out this afternoon, even self-realization, happiness, solidarity, hope, etc. are commodities these days.
June 19, 2007 at 12:12 am
Adela, you write “The one thing we *must* as critics search for is for a way of thinking about a kind of solidarity that will not end up as yet another market product.” Will you allow me to emphasize “we must search” rather than “we must find”? The search itself is honourable. This is not to say that we’ll never find. I for one have found some solidarity here, that can’t be bought or sold. I’m honoured to get to know you, and that goes for everyone who has participated in this conversation.
June 19, 2007 at 12:37 am
I am also very honoured that this blog has hosted this conversation. I am, of course, not closing it off with this comment, though. But I am deeply moved to read all of your opinions, and I find a lot of encouragement in them and in the discussion itself. Like John, I enjoy the process, the search, as well, even if there may be no clear forseeable “answers” or “results”. The fact that Adela and Ch dicussed this out of the blogsphere is even more moving, the fact that what goes on here can still be discussed- thought about “out there”… Thank you all. I will be back here with some other thoughts.
June 19, 2007 at 2:43 pm
At the risk of sounding like a charity giving, self-righteous, guilt-ridden, liberal person I have to say that Ginger and I give money to Oxfam… and are currently looking for an honest organization that we can money to in Mexico as well.
John, THAT IS THE HOW… and I know is not much and I know it doesn’t move or alter the foundation of an unfair, inhumane system known as capitalism but since John also mentioned one of the four truths of the buddha lets recall that parable found in tibetan buddhism that says that in order to save the life of a man that has been shot with an arrow the first thing to do is to pull the arrow out of his body (hunger being the arrow in the poverty-hunger issue).
We also donate money to other local organizations/programs such as the shelter for men, and the shelter for women & children (we’re also planning on actually help, Umberto will along with us, in the kitchen in these two places… )
We are not, by US standards anyway, wealty at all (in fact we might be barely above the US Govt. poverty line) but we think is important to give and to share of the little profits made of an unfair system.
It’s all about choices: what do we choose to do with the surplus (little or big) of our economic activity or inactivity (some people on welfare donate money!).
thanks for such a passionate and intriguing discussion (here’s my two cents: another donation).
June 19, 2007 at 2:57 pm
Bloggerista, thank you. I accept that as a how, in fact we too are “charity giving, self-righteous, guilt-ridden, liberals”: our target organizations include Doctors Without Borders, UNICEF, to both of whom we give $50 monthly, and Greenpeace, the Sierra Club, the American Civil Liberties Union, Planned Parenthood, along with Pacifica Radio, to all of whom we give annually. And I love your parable. And I love the parable of the person dangling from a cliff upon which sits a ravenous tiger, by a root that’s coming loose, with one ripe strawberry in reach … what do do? Grab the strawberry and enjoy, as you fall. Plus, we are librarians, which is a service profession. Plus, our son, who is a photographer, went to Laos to document the installation of two hand-powered computers that would let peasants have the data necessary to bring their crops to market when it was a good time to sell. Plus, our daughter is a social worker. Those too are all hows. Plus, entering into this kind of conversation is another how. To quote John Lennon, you say you want a revolution, we all doin what we can. We march when there are marches … I guess we are doin all we can. Whether or not that’s enough. Thank you. I’m just sad, I guess, that it “is not much and I know it doesn’t move or alter the foundation of an unfair, inhumane system” . But I WILL remember what you say, and nex time I see someone with an arrow in ‘em, I’ll remember to pull the arrow out.
June 19, 2007 at 3:07 pm
I am too debt-ridden to donate any considerable amount of money. I live in a constant state of anxiety over money. I do give money whenever I have a chance, but it’s only on a symbolic level. I have also donated clothes to Oxfam and books to different public libraries, here and in Mexico (even though the bureaucratic procedure to do that is more difficult than one would think). But I have always worked in things that could be considered “social service”, and I have also done work for free (like teaching graphic narrative techniques to children from imporverished areas in Mexico City, for instance). I invested a considerable amount of years of my “youth” (my whole twenties) involved in non-profit cultural activities. I always sacrificed personal gain in order to participate in creating a cultural community, an “artistic scene”; I promoted events, became a musical adviser for musical festivals, published in every imaginable publication, alll for almost no money, doing it just because I believe in the importance of culture and in the liberating power of education. I’ve been a member of PETA since I was 15 and promoted Food Not Bombs in different fanzines I published and wrote for in Mexico when I was a teenager. I started translating brochures about AIDS, STDs and unwanted pregnancies when I was 18, and since then I have tried to translate stuff that I consider ethical or politically important. Now I am a translator for the Memoria y Tolerancia Museum, and I am currently working on the brief seeking international sponsors. It will be a museum dedicated to educate the younger population about tolerance and diversity (it is a joint effort with the Holocaust Museum in Washington DC). Even though I do get paid for it, it’s something I do because I believe in its good cause.
I taught for five years at the National University in Mexico for a symbolic pay (about 4 USD per class?), and I never took up full-time positions doing anything else, just to be able to keep teaching.
June 19, 2007 at 3:44 pm
Well my darling other half has somewhat answered the question set to me: such a simple question “How?”
I think that everyone here is doing something. I threw the quote out (and Singer has a whole book on what one can do) because I think a lot about misery and happiness. I too often live in misery as I suffer from depression (I’ll write more on this on my blog soon I hope), and I did not come for a privileged background (mildly put I assure you). But I think that misery is a particularily Western problem. I don’t think that people starving to death are misersable. I think they suffer which I think are very different things. And I am by no means knocking suffering. I think that by focusing on suffering as opposed to focusing on misery we could evalate misery. But anyway….I know the how part…
To start, I am not a Buddhist but I do employ a lot of Buddhist thought in my living. This means that I try to live in a conscious manner. Every choice we make from what we eat to what we wear should involve a thought about where things came from, what human hands touched them, and a prayer to the universe for those hands. And I try to bring this into how I spend my money. I ask myself…”Do I need these things? Will these things add to my life in a way?” I really want to eliminate frviolous spending, and then give that money to someone who needs it. And I don’t think it’s always frivious to buy things like books and cds, I might add. But sometimes it is…anyway it’s a moment by monent thing.
Ernest and John, you both do an amazing amount of work, and giving. This is the how I think. These simple choices. I also realized today that I have shifted my thesis work to something that has implications in both the social and academic world. I did this because I have a hard time reconciling an intellectual life with my social concerns. Talking about these things, Ernesto you are right, strikes me as valuable and important. It means conscious living.
And again turning to Buddhism on a couple of different levels. First, in Tibetan Buddhism it is important to keep bellies full because it is only when one does not have to worry about the physical things that they are able to work towards enlightenment. Second, Buddhism do say that life is suffering (not misery), and the important thing is not to embrace suffering but to acknowledge it and then do something about it.
June 19, 2007 at 3:45 pm
Jesus, I sound like a hippie LOL. I’m not by the way…much of the time one would mistake me for an ironic post-modernist.
June 19, 2007 at 3:55 pm
“It is only when one does not have to worry about the physical things that they are able to work towards enlightenment”. Maaaan, we gotta make sure CONACYT and other studentship funding bodies read this!
sigh. (glad to see you chip in again, Ginger!)
June 19, 2007 at 4:01 pm
Also, why is it then that some people who don’t have to worry about the physical things never for once consider working towards enlightenment? I wonder… maybe because the Western, Christian view is so different? Simone Weil was what I would call a truly enlightenened individual, and she would just eat berries once in a while (she died after she voluntarily stopped eating altogether). Maybe because she voluntarily did it, instead of just dying of hunger… I dunno. This is unrelated, but I just thought about it and wanted to share it.
In that sense, I’m closer to Budhism than Christianity, hands down! ;)
June 19, 2007 at 6:20 pm
Ernesto, this is all your fault: 37 comments!! This is what happens when you post something like this. AND, I should add, this kind of conversation/rant/bitching/indepth commentary/joking/ (all blended togethe)r) need to happen more often wherevere it is possible: so let’s make it happen, let’s make people around us talk about this stuff and make them donate their time or money: everything counts.
I had proposed to another friend to create a program known as “Adopt a Politician” where you would pick a politician from around the world and “educate” him/her with literature, music, food, etc. and, more important, make him/her a little more sympathetic and compassionate… Then the politician will be asked to write letters to you about his/her experience: Dear Horacio, today I discovered la poesia de los contemporaneos, or today i finally understood that human rights should be protected, and so on
It saddens me to know that Simone Weil died that way but who knows what was going through her mind when she decided to do eating (do you know Ernesto?).
thanks again to everybody here for such an enlightning conversation: the size of the comments section now is starting to remind of that Cortazar short story where the footnotes become, suddenly, inadvertedly, the story itself but in a good way here, the best of the ways!
June 19, 2007 at 6:55 pm
I believe Weil decided to stop eating in solidarity with the people still in occupied France. She was in England at the time. Ernesto, I hope you don’t mind my jumping in here and answering a question addressed to you.
Ginger, I think poor people starving to death *are* miserable. I’ve seen too many photos of mothers holding their starved dead babies to think otherwise. They suffer. But it’s true, the affluent invent their own miseries. Maybe because the affluent have the luxury of imagination?
June 19, 2007 at 8:29 pm
Just want to add that I’m back in my office after a trip to the doctor to discuss a growth on my face – turns out to be basal cell carcinoma, most likely. The least invasive form of sskin cancer possible … most likely. Which for me put a whole new urgent spin on this conversation. All I can keep thinking is: pull out the arrow, pull out the arros … and that line from Auden, as he rewrote and then rejected it: we must love one another and die. Did I say that already. Well, now I say it to you.
June 19, 2007 at 8:30 pm
Sorry for the typos above.
June 19, 2007 at 8:38 pm
John, hope everything’s well> and yes, let’s pull the arrow.
June 19, 2007 at 11:09 pm
Shit John, I hope it goes well. The Quakers have a great saying “I’ll hold you in the light.” So I’ll hold you in the light.
And yes shit yes we all have to pull out the arrow…that’s why we’re here, aruging talking, and trying so hard to understand.
As for misery…I’m not articulating it well. I’ll try to work this out because I don’t want to demean anyone’s experience. I don’t think we invent misery in the West…I just think it’s a different way of encountering pain. I’m struggling with trying to articulate this…argh.
June 20, 2007 at 12:35 am
John, I’m sorry to hear that. I hope you get well soon. It’s a good thing they’ve found out what it is, though. My best wishes, brother. I’m there with you!
June 20, 2007 at 3:35 am
John, I’ve been away from the conversation with a busy day… the time we donate vs the time we steal from ourselves. I really hope things go well. It sounds like it will be under control. I know we will all be thinking about you and sending the best of vibes your way!